Add palm tree preset – needs tagging clarification first

[tordans]

OSM Tag(s)

Unclear, see below

How would you like this tag to see supported?

As a Preset

Label

natural

Aliases

No response

Terms

palm tree

Link to OSM Wiki page

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dtree#Palm_trees

Status of the Tag

Unspecified / Unknown

Usage of the tag

For usage see boxes on https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:natural%3Dtree#Tags_for_Palm_trees

Replaces other Tag?

We might want to add deprecations for the more obvious misstaggings like species=palm|Palm

Regional Tag?

global

Further Information

In #956 we added presets for broadleaved and needleleaved trees which allows to render those on the map with a separate icon and also add them to the map with more tag-details in one click.

However, we skipped palm trees in that PR because the tagging is unclear.

Thanks to rapideditor/temaki#87 we have a nice icon for palm trees and I think we should try to give them their own preset.

Status quo & next steps

Right now, the wiki suggest that there is no consensus on how to tag palm trees.

I think the ideal way forward would be for someone in a region with palm trees to pick this up and discuss a well thought out tagging. Part of that should be a deprecation list so we can help updating the old data. IMO this could be done via the proposal process (wiki) or the community forum + a voting there.

Research

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Tag:natural%3Dtree#Palm_trees says

"Palm trees" are trees of the family Arecaceae. As of 2021-09-06 there is no community consensus on how to tag these trees, although several different tags are in use. Most of these tags are technically incorrect, because palm is not the scientific name of these trees and palm trees are a family rather than a genus or species. See Talk:Tags for Palm trees.

https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Talk:Tag:natural%3Dtree#Tags_for_Palm_trees says

The most common tags in use are…

taxon:family=Arecaceae 35.490x
type=palm 30.848

[1ec5]

Compared to the approach discussed in osmlab/name-suggestion-index#8324, I currently favor this approach because it would allow for localization.

It’s interesting that taxon:family is so common. I wonder if it’s from an import. This could be a good thing, because if someone happens to know the exact species of a palm tree, they’ll be able to set species without downgrading the Palm Tree preset to a mere Tree preset (which would tempt another mapper to erase that tag).

[tordans]

I wonder if it’s from an import.

Looks like it https://taghistory.raifer.tech/#***/taxon%3Afamily/&***/type/palm&***/leaf_type/palm&***/species/palm&***/species/Palm&***/genus/Arecaceae&***/taxon/Arecaceae

[b1tw153]

Was there enough consensus to go with natural=tree + taxon:family=Arecaceae as a preset for palm trees?

[tordans]

@b1tw153 we have been chatting about this on SlackUS, right? I still thing we are missing any form of formal discussion on this (I might be missing something…). So, for this repo there is no good reference to use as a base for the decision to pick on over the used taggings.

I also thing, that formalizing this is only a few hours work… so doable:

1. Create a proposal page
2. Document the tagging as in use and to be formalized; have a headline about other taggings and why they are to be deprecated to the new tagging
3. Request comments in a forum thread and by following https://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Proposal_process#Propose

[ivanbranco]

See also: https://community.openstreetmap.org/t/leaf-type-palm-is-anything-wrong-with-it/109646

[tordans]

Update: The linked discussion has some activity again and someone started mass editing to use leaf_type=palm, eg. https://www.openstreetmap.org/changeset/161638547

[matkoniecz]

Anyone interested in establishing tagging consensus?

If there is no ongoing progress or not even anyone planning to do anything soon I think that closing issue here would make sense as it is not actionable in this repo until it changes

[matkoniecz]

closing as not actionable in this project until community fixes tagging

this definitely should be in presets, but this project is for making iD presets, not central planning authority for OSM tagging schema